BOC looks to undermine Winder annexations

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Wednesday, November 28. 2012

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The Barrow County Board of Commissioners is considering a strategic move that could undermine the City of Winder’s bid to annex additional property around the Barrow Crossings area. In a bombshell Tuesday night, commissioner Ben Hendrix proposed that the BOC adopt two resolutions at its Dec. 11 meeting: The first would terminate the county’s 15-year-old contract with the City of Winder for fire services in the city limits; the second would create a “Barrow County Fire Service District” based on existing service areas the county has agreed to with the incorporated towns. While the move was made by Hendrix, it was incoming BOC chairman Pat Graham who penned the statement and was the driving force behind it.
For the full story, see the Nov. 28 issue of the Barrow Journal.

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#1 Larry on 11/28/12 at 12:03 PM

Big deal. Winder does not need Barrow Fire. Winder has its own equipment and full time firefighters which are professional. Winders ISO rating is about as good as it gets. Barrow Fire ISO rating is as bad as it gets.

#1.1 Reality on 11/30/12 at 05:28 AM

It is that way because of the assistance of the Barrow County Fire Department. Without the agreement, Winder loses a good portion of its Fire Services. In turn, it will cause your ISO rating to drop, and your insurance to go up. If you want to maintain your current ISO rating, Winder will be forced to build more fire stations, hire more personnel, and purchase additional equipment. If not, your response times are going to increase, and the amount of equipment is going to decrease.

#1.1.1 Sandy Tanner on 12/02/12 at 08:02 AM

The reason the city has an ISO rating of a 3 is not because of Barrow County. ISO depends on water, training, and communication. The city has a 3 and the county has a 5/10. If you want to know the truth the county piggy backed off the ladder truck for years until they decided to get one. The public needs to know how the county fire pepartment actually runs. Most of the time they have to be paged out twice and most ambulances respond with no lights and sirens. I'm tired of people bashing the city fire service they do a great job.

#1.2 merge on 12/03/12 at 10:27 PM

Need to merge cities and county. But that will not happen due to power struggles. Too bad Winder can not secede from county.

#2 anon on 11/28/12 at 12:03 PM

Mr. Buffington, How would creating a "fire service district" undermine the attempt at annexation by the city?

#2.1 Pope on 11/28/12 at 03:48 PM

basically, they are saying that the county would not provide services to the newly annexed areas of Winder and would almost force Winder to build another station closer to that part of town to properly serve them. the county currently owns that stations that would serve those areas now. By having the "fire service distract" they would be telling all of the other unincorporated areas not to panic, they would still provide service for them as usual.

#3 Let Me Understand... on 11/28/12 at 12:09 PM

Let Me Understand: New BOC chairman Pat Graham who Formally Led the ANNEXATION CRAZY Town of BRASELTON, One of the MOST ANNEXING TOWNS in the ENTIRE STATE, is now trying to Undermine an rather small in comparision annexation by the City of Winder, who has been doing only a few annexations, limited at best, over the last 20 YEARS, is willing to CUT ties and BREAK Agreements with the Countyseat over this, right out of the gate, for the first time I find myself considering that maybe Yearwood was not so bad afterall. I can see a 1 term BOC Chairman and since Hendrix represents ME, I will see about that next election too.

This is NOT an Example of GOOD GOVERNMENT, I guess we have 4 YEARS of BARROW County IN-FIGHTING in our Future, Thought I would only see that crap at the Federal Level(Congress). I thought we elected a solution, Not Furthered the Problem here in Barrow. I guess I was WRONG AGAIN.

#3.1 Karen on 11/29/12 at 11:50 AM

As the mayor of Brasselton she was looking after the best interest of the city. As the chairman of the county she's looking after the best interest of the county

#4 Tom Foolery on 11/28/12 at 02:15 PM

All she did was expose the Winder annexation down Hwy. 81 for the sham that it is. Winder already has the gas and water territories which are their money makers. They would lose money on any other services provided, including less income on water because rates are cheaper inside the city. It is obvious Winder planned to increase its revenue by taking the 3 mill fire tax and then putting on a general property tax. Makes no sense otherwise. Glad they got caught.

#5 James Wilson on 11/28/12 at 06:36 PM

I for one am happy to see that the BOC has a back bone. I think its a good idea and should of happened before now.Good job Mrs Graham and the BOC now keep it going and dont let it stall.

#6 J.B. Moore on 11/29/12 at 05:22 PM

Can someone who agrees with the annexation sell me on it? What benefit besides another layer of government will come from it? Sounds to me like Ms Graham is doing her job by representing her constituents. If she were mayor of winder I'm sure she would be for the annexation. As of now I have high hopes that she will not forget who she works for and continue to represent the counties best interest.

#7 John Lee on 12/01/12 at 09:26 AM

Many of you make it sound like Pat Graham should work against Winder. I thought Winder was in Barrow County. I thought that Barrow County collects tax inside of Winder to support Barrow County. I thought Winder was the County Seat. Most of your tax money goes to Barrow County not Winder.

#8 and we on 12/01/12 at 03:46 PM

want to keep the tax going to less govt bodies not more.... not everyone wants to join the city of winder, hmm they more then likely would have bought property in WINDER rather then not in WINDER or whatever city. stop trying to volenteer folks to become city members when they like it just fine not being in the CITY

#8.1 Come on on 12/02/12 at 08:22 AM

Nobody is being MADE to come into he city. Can you name one?...They ask and the folks say yes. There are benefits to coming in the city. Why gripe about what others do with THEIR property?

#9 yes on 12/02/12 at 03:17 PM

unfortunatly if bob jones is not wanting to come in to city but phil perkins and his two other neighbors either dont care or say yes then Mr Jones would be forced onto the city.

Oakwood last year i think tried doing this annexing and thank goodness the folks not in Oakwood stopped them. hopefully Winder and the power grab get stopped also

#9.1 OK on 12/02/12 at 05:09 PM

So what you are saying is that nobody has been forced into the city? What are the problems then? If the people that are being put in,want tyo get in, what business is it of me or others? I could see if people were forced in but so far I dont see that. Is there someone that is being forced in?

#10 well on 12/02/12 at 09:02 PM

city officials should remember that individual annexation ordinances must still be
approved by the U.S. Justice Department pursuant to Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act of 1965
(42 U.S.C. §1973c) and a preclearance letter must be submitted to the Department of Community
Affairs.
1 O.C.G.A. § 36-36-113.
2 O.C.G.A. § 36-36-11.
2

is Winder trying to create better voting block for those in office in city and friend they want in county????

#11 Good Grief, Get a LIFE, What is the Problem?? on 12/03/12 at 01:04 PM

LOOK: Nobody is being MADE to come into the City Limits, there are BENEFITS to being IN the City, IF YOU dont want annexed in THEN DONT.

It is AMERICA, People get a CHOICE to ANNEX into a city, and up until recently the COUNTY had NO SAY about it, now recent law allows the County to speak up and "Vote" on the issue, but they CANNOT usually Stop an OWNER from Chosing to Annex into a City.

So what is all this chatter? There is no "exposing" anything, this happens all over the Free USA, and BRASELTON annexed itself over 350% of its original size and into 4 Counties, but ALL of you who dont want the Services or perks from being in a City, THEN STAY as you are. Winder's INSURANCE RATES are significantly LOWER and Water is Lower among other things. BE FREE Make Your own choice, LET US CHOOSE TOO, I CHOOSE TO BE IN THE CITY (or support communism).

#12 J.B. Moore on 12/04/12 at 12:32 PM

What are those benefits? Paying city taxes? The benefit for people being moved into braselton is the fact that they were lacking service, I highly doubt Gwinnett pd patrolled much their little piece of that pie and those people had something to gain. Winder is wanting to take area and continue having the residents being served by the county and add those citizens a layer of tax. Please I am up for any debate but please sell my on the benefit of what those people will get that's better. And it is not insurance rates if their gonna be served by the city fire department that doubles response time.

#12.1 Anon on 12/04/12 at 04:28 PM

Why don't you go to the City Council meeting tonight at 6:00? Maybe someone can shed some light for you.

#12.2 Hey J.B. --Really, what is the Deal (or yours)..?? on 12/04/12 at 08:04 PM

J.B. Moore, Has anyone asked you to be annexed? You seem to have an issue with OTHERS RIGHTS to be annexed in, what is your personal beef with those Citizens, Property Owners or the City of Winder?

This seems to bother you that these owners or the City would want to join each other. Since you would decline the offer it appears then what else is your issue is really the question.

Why did all those new cities get created over the last year? People want additional benefits, control, representative governments that will respond to their need and concerns, Winder has advantages to offer, I have interacted with both governments personally and I have had good very good interactions with Winder. I have a MUCH better Response time by Winder PD and Winder Fire, Lower Insurance, better garbage, Street lights than I do by the County and we own properties in the City Limits and in unincorporated Barrow County(and 2 other Barrow cities).

No one at Barrow County or any of You, batted an Eye when Braselton ANNEXED Chateau Elan and miles of other lands, that was/is a Huge HIGH-DOLLAR, HIGH INCOME development compared to a shopping center area.

Here the other thing, a Strong Countyseat, BENEFITS the Entire County, as Winder is in the County. I dont see what the fuss is about, BUT You can CHOSE for YOUR OWN PROPERTY, if you want to be in any city (If you own any anywhere near one).

#13 Beauregard on 12/04/12 at 02:54 PM

I think if an area is annexe by the city then they would be served by city services instead of county.If that's not correct then you are right , it's just another layer of taxes. The barrow sherries dept. is way over burdened as it is so if the city of winder begins patrols and emergency calls there, then the people would get a quicker ie better service.
The same is overwhelmingly true for the fire dept.s the city of Winder fire dept. is one of the best in the area,p whereas the county fd is one of the poorest abled in the entire state.There are volunteer depts. in South Georgia that only have pine tops and rakes and flannel shirts that are more able than the barrow fd has become in recent years..
It would seem to me that on those two points alone that the people in that area would be better off being a pa of the city of winder rather than unincorporated barrow county.

#14 J.B. Moore on 12/05/12 at 07:54 PM

You have a right to do whatever you want, if you want more taxes then by all means have them. On the garbage issue I pay ten dollars a month and I get to CHOOSE my service, it is not forced on me. The point is winder will not and in the near future cannot service a bigger area. I do have a problem with winder taking in tax dollars and the county still servicing as with 911 communications need I go further? The sheriff's office is phenomenal in my opinion and that is not taking away from other agencies and they provide great service. God willing I will never need fire services so I cannot comment on that area. Good luck and Godspeed on your endeavor to give the gub ment more of your money, I'll keep mine.

#14.1 Mr Moore's battle against change.. on 12/10/12 at 10:53 AM

Winder has NO City Taxes Mr Moore. Our family has properties within 3 Barrow Cities and out in the County, we have dealt with all the local governments, the County is one of the MORE Difficult to deal with. The WPD response time was typically Twice as fast (about 15 Sq miles to cover verses 262.2 Sq miles could be it?) I think the Sheriffs Dept is a good agency, may I note led by former WPD Sgt, now Sheriff Jud Smith, and Winder is Still within his jurisdiction(he is Countywide). My Winder City garbage has been superior to the county provided options, the city picks up more items, promotes/provides recycling and cleans more. Water is cheaper, Insurance rates cheaper. I pay $15 year MORE Tax for Street lights, but in the City we HAVE Street lights. What other TAXES are you concerned that WE will pay, since YOU Will not (as you are on every forum against this issue)?

#14.1.1 Mike Buffington on 12/10/12 at 03:55 PM

Winder does have a 3-mill city tax for fire.

#14.1.1.1 Mr Moore's battle against annexation.. on 12/10/12 at 04:27 PM

Yes. You are correct Mike. I can live with that and those who choose to be included will certainly be happy with the Fire Coverage for that 3 mils, I have been. I challange you to get out your stopwatch and time fire calls (or request and rely on the data the FOIA gives you that they provide) I have noticed/experienced clearly better response time. I say this with a family member who was employed by BOTH departments in the past and is still works in this field.
Mike, My perception is that you have taken a side(not from the comment)based on the style of writing the BJ articles, that you have a position on this. My question is this, are you still a Jackson Co resident or do you live in Barrow Co? (just curious how personal our news is to you)

#14.1.1.1.1 Mike Buffington on 12/10/12 at 05:57 PM

WE've not taken any side on the issue and I've not written about it...yet. Don't read too much into news articles because there is no secret code we employ. If we do have thoughts about an issue, in this case annexations, we will spell that out very clearly on the editorial page. But sometimes, it's best to let an issue simmer and see what happens for a while before commenting.

#15 J.B. Moore on 12/10/12 at 08:19 PM

One my garbage is just dandy, every wed. It's gone and for ten bucks a month. Two of my properties are provided with private water contractor, oconee water or whatever and that runs me 15 bucks a month. As I stated before I could care less for those whom choose to add a layer of government to their lives, I asked one question and I still sit here waiting for an answer. The only rebuttals I have seen are those in which other people are selling themselves on more government pushing into their lives. I am a liberatarian If it doesn't affect me, do what you want and when they make other areas as rundown as the current downtown you can scream more government is the answer. Multi million dollar companies research and the chose to be in a unincorporated area for a reason, the evidence speaks for itself. If you feel you garbage can is emptied in a more hip or popular way to make your service better than mine I have to concede I pay ten bucks a month guaranteed for a year and I don't care.

#15.1 longtime in barrow on 12/10/12 at 11:53 PM

Mr Moore, I notice also that you preach "I am a liberatarian If it doesn't affect me, do what you want" --but then you seem to defy your own words. You disparage and engage in battles(of words)against the city government and these property owners for their choices. Why do you care what these people do? What is it to you?

You seem to dislike Winder, but Barrow County became in existance due to Winder, and yes downtown is old, like 1800's but just because something annexes in, is not destined to be "rundown". I think you have a beef with the city you play out here on the Journal forum personally. You gave your opinions, this is my observation.

And You are several miles from any city, I assume for a reason. So good for you. Sorry about the Winder address.

So do you think if you continue to bantor here on the newspaper forum daily that it might help you the next time you run for office? (county commissioner)

#15.2 Just Sayin' on 12/11/12 at 10:26 AM

J.B. Moore,
Don't you work for Forsyth County? Why don't you just move there?

#16 Zack on 12/11/12 at 07:26 AM

Living in Winder, I can't help but see more important issues that need to be addressed. For starters, we have a serious traffic issue, we have serious parking issues, we have road damage issues and so on. Addressing these issues would better benefit us citizens. I'm still not certain why the focus is outside the city. Is it that we need more money to address the current issues, or have we just lost focus.

#17 Zack on 12/11/12 at 11:56 AM

I'm still struggling to understand how this would benefit our citizens. I mean we have serious traffic issues here in Winder, parking issues, road issues and so on. Is it that we need to look somewhere else for money to handle these issues, or is it just a lack of focus on what's important?

#18 J.B. Moore on 12/11/12 at 08:04 PM

I must concede you got me "just sayin" coming from an individual who hides behind anonymous names. First off if it were not for caring for elderly family I may just do that. Oh wait let's compare property values to let's say Forsyth County since you brought it up, oh wait you can look at Forbes annual wealthiest counties and fastest growing for that information. Maybe our community could learn from well the best school system in the state of Georgia or one of the most appealing counties for business. I have a family and a financial interest in Barrow County I would like to see this county thrive because we all win. You are a prime example of the problem with this county and I will back up my statement: I ask what advantage is there to annexation? answer: winder fire is better than barrow and faster response, but we don't want to build another station we want to use barrow fire for free...WHAT?? Same question: answer: My garbage pickup is better from winder, I give up free choice of who I do business with and pay more than you but my trash is picked up better than yours....uh ok. Same question: answer; My water is better and why don't you just move, I cant make any legitimate argument that would justify another layer of government so why don't you move!! There is no reason, it's a power grab pure and simple, if they want it they need to pay for their power grab.

#19 JB Moore Neighbor on 12/12/12 at 05:22 AM

No, you won't move to Forsyth because you couldn't get away with what you do here.

And didn't you get in trouble from IA for past blogs?

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BOC looks to undermine Winder annexations

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